No.38954
琴雀 is a weird name
No.38960
>>38954how do you even read that
No.38961
That guy has some 90s pants on
No.38962
-1 true secret poster
No.38963
>>38960きんじゃく, apparently? I can only find one source for the reading...
No.38967
i agree. my heart is filled with hate and disillusionment
No.38973
>>38953That movie fucking sucked by the way, boat jason more like
No.38974
All the vtuber, sph and analfags left... It's not the same
No.38978
>>38975
my hate is directed solely at people like you, and my disillusionment is the only thing that directs my actions, priming me to barely post, knowing i'm surrounded by such awful company
No.38980
>>38978>>38979But I wouldn't say you're "surrounded" by it. It only seems to be a few people and recently I feel empowered to strike people down if they do this outside of /secret/. I share your disillusionment and mentioned that the only way I can relate to people is if their freedom is removed, but I'm willing to strip that freedom from people outside of here.
To an extent, at least. People seem to have been behaving more outside of here. Maybe that's why /secret/ is so much worse, actually.
No.38985
Actually it's more the character assassination that I don't appreciate. It really enrages me to think about. As though you're so sure of my true personality that you can make a summary judgement of myself as a person and say that I can't be worth posting with because of one or two slights that are essentially nothing in the grand scheme of things. You're an unbearable perfectionist. Delete /secret/ from your browser tab and never look at it again if it offends you so much, that's what I'm doing to not feed into it. But don't get your panties in a bunch with the rest of the site because of it. You're personally worsening your own experience for no reason other than to feel bad about yourself and wallow in despair at the imperfection of others, like you're so perfect yourself.
None of you are perfect.
No.38986
Make another post responding and then let me permaban you from /secret/ so you don't have any way of coming back here so you can stop engaging in self-destructive behavior. Idiot.
No.38987
Actually maybe that's what I'll do to fix this place. I'll just ban anyone who makes even the slightest infraction. Maybe I can convince the other mods to give you a non-ip readable mod here so you can kill it off for good.
No.38988
There's not even a fucking purpose for this board really anymore with how much is allowed outside of /secret/ except to contain the absolute worst of the worst posts. There's no fucking reason to be posting here.Or considering it in your mind at all, that's the most infuriating part. That people will explicitly not use other boards because of this shitting zone for specific individuals. I'd say something harsh but I don't even want to say it because I agree with you and can't stand that we can't come to the same conclusion that we should just give up on this board altogether and stop using it. Fuck everyone trying to make /secret/ a legitimate board instead of the ones people actually use.
No.38989
If I couldn't put up with people not being the perfect images I had of them then I would've just quit the internet entirely, instead I choose to put up with it because I'd rather there be flawed individuals I can agree and share camaraderie with rather than fake individuals who only put up appearances.
No.38991
/secret/ should just be deleted
No.38993
>>38990You should calm down with some anal, queen
No.38998
>>38984>You don't even know what posts I make, retard.I was replying to the poster of a post, not a person; "people like you" referring to low-quality posters doing drive-by spam that doesn't even try to engage with or generate discussion. The "pseudoperson" of the collective style of kuso posts typically found on /secret/; the low-effort embedded youtube links with no meat to the OP or post other than typically being lazy reaction youtubers, posts with overt politics that doesn't even try fitting in with the broader culture, template posts, buzzword-laden posts, 4chanisms stolen from the most low-quality boards. All of those are the collective "you" I was referring to, the poster of such a post.
You, as in you replying, cease being a pseudoperson when you break this façade and reply as not the same style of poster, but as the poster themself taking credit for such a post and taking offense that others (myself) would find it distasteful.
>>38985I have no idea who you are, other than the poster of a kuso posts, because you are anonymous. I can only identify posts with a particular commonality to them because being anonymous, I have no idea what posts you may make outside of those posts if there is no commonality between them. I didn't think this needed explaining, but apparently it does because you think identifying characteristics to a style of posts is analogous to identifying a singular person.
>you're so sure of my true personalityNowhere did I say or imply that.
>You're an unbearable perfectionist.You are literally victimizing yourself by projecting an imagined threat of what you think I believe, having animosity for you in particular. I do not. I dislike the posts, not you, unless you claim ownership of them and make them part of your identity to such an extent that they are inseparable, and if that is the case (which it seems you are inadvertently making that case), then I positively detest that aspect to you. Nowhere, however, do I imply that I detest you as a whole because I cannot identify you outside of the commonality of kuso posts.
>You're personally worsening your own experienceIt is disillusioning to post alongside such a poster because I would rather not associate with a poster who makes it part of their identity that they make kuso posts. Why? Well, why wouldn't that be the case? If this were a forum for animal lovers, would it not strike you as distasteful, off-putting, and questionable if there was a board for euthanasia and abuse?
>the imperfection of others, like you're so perfect yourself.To endorse, by virtue of existence, that which is directly at odds with the broader ideology of the site IS disillusioning to the highest degree. If others have character faults by virtue of the distasteful posts they make, they
should be easily mitigatible by not providing an outlet for them here. Public drunkenness is distasteful, so there are laws against public consumption; if kuso posts are distasteful, then why is the outlet for them
here, when they could just as easily be anywhere else? There is nothing which inherently compels them here, but the fact that they are here is disillusioning!
>with how much is allowed outside of /secret/... There's no fucking reason to be posting here.The fact that you can make such a revolutionary claim, bordering on divine inspiration or telepathy to have come so close to the understanding I have, as the source of my disillusionment, and yet still not comprehend what you have just said is astonishing.
>we should just give up on this board altogether and stop using it. Fuck everyone trying to make /secret/ a legitimate board instead of the ones people actually use.The only reason to give up on this board is because of what it has become, not because of any inherent quality it has. It was legitimate when not used as a dumping ground for everything distasteful, but in its current state, I would agree; it's unsalvageable and worthy of deletion on the grounds that it's reputation is forever tarnished by such abhorrent posts as continually find home on it.
>If I couldn't put up with people not being the perfect images I had of them then I would've just quit the internet entirelyNothing compels anyone to be their whole selves. It is fine and good to compartmentalize ones interests for sake of harmony. At a workplace, fraternization isn't tolerated; at a club with a shared interest, fraternity is encouraged and people share themselves with others. Going beyond the scope of shared interest, naturally inspires conflict; bringing real-world politics into fictional setting is one of the most egregious and common examples of unforced errors. These are examples, not a reply to you.
With my disillusionment with Kissu, I spend the vast majority of my posting energy on Sageru #qa. #qa embodies everything I value: funposting in response to funposts, serious posting in response to effort posts. Even if Anonymous is in #jp, there is active attempt to keep everything that #jp represents, as far away from #qa as possible -- politics get banned, low quality foreign shibboleths draw ire and kicks at the the least, and direct mention to go post somewhere else. /secret/ is the exact opposite: It says, "yes, kuso posts and kuso posters are welcome here, they're so welcome we'll move them here for you to continue your kuso discussions". There's no attempt at compartmentalization by pushing things outside the bounds of reasonable, permitted discussion. Containment boards do not contain and keep things out of sight, they provide an outlet with endorsement on the same platform. No one has to browse /secret/, but the reason to browse it is to check if it is not the same /secret/ it currently is; occasionally it becomes something else, something approaching usable and worth browsing -- somewhere between the seasonal boards and funposts of /jp/ -- and then it inevitably falls back into become a haven of kuso posts again. And that is disappointing and disillusioning.
No.39000
That people have given you enough time of day, that you think saying you prefer sageru has any value, is the true tragedy I have witnessed today.
No.39002
What's up with /secret/? Just nuke it if it sucks why do you have to write ten thousand word essays on it?
No.39003
>>38998>The fact that you can make such a revolutionary claim, bordering on divine inspiration or telepathy to have come so close to the understanding I have, as the source of my disillusionment, and yet still not comprehend what you have just said is astonishiI do understand everything about your disillusionment. And that's why I want /secret/ gone. But it can't be gone so we should instead collectively ignore it.
No.39004
I don't understand how this concept is so hard to wrap your head around. /secret/ is only as bad as you let it influence you to believe it is. If you just completely block the board then it's completely separable from the rest of kissu.
>No one has to browse /secret/, but the reason to browse it is to check if it is not the same /secret/ it currently is; occasionally it becomes something else, something approaching usable and worth browsing -- somewhere between the seasonal boards and funposts of /jp/ -- and then it inevitably falls back into become a haven of kuso posts again. And that is disappointing and disillusioning.
Again, don't. Don't use /secret/. Don't hope for /secret/ to become something better, assume it won't and blacklist it from your memory. There's nothing irredeemable about the rest of kissu. It's perfectly fine and even doing well for itself. AND
>The fact that you can make such a revolutionary claim, bordering on divine inspiration or telepathy to have come so close to the understanding I have, as the source of my disillusionment, and yet still not comprehend what you have just said is astonishing.
I do comprehend what I said. Maybe you didn't if you think that I meant it in a way that's negative on the rest of kissu. No, I always thought of /secret/ as a way of countering over-moderation when I couldn't funpost to my heart's content. But now I can so I'm happy to post outside of /secret/ like I would back on 4/qa/ itself without having to put up a barrier between myself and my posts.
No.39006
I resented funposting on /secret/ from the start because I would rather have funposts on the rest of kissu than somewhere that can easily just become sealed off from the rest of the site. Once I realized I could post whatever on the rest of kissu that's not the trash material of /secret/ is when I stopped funposting here almost entirely. I think it gets to the heart of the issue that another Anonymous had with his posts being moved here. There's no value to posting what you feel has value on a board like this. Not just because of the presence of shit, but because it does nothing for the greater site if you're actually invested in seeing things grow and become better.
No.39007
>>39005joke board that stayed past its expiration date and then became dumping grounds for stuff that wasn't up to high standards on the rest of kissu and then became a shitting grounds with the current crap
it's not worth posting on because there's no reason to post here in the first place
No.39008
the only value it could possibly serve is for messy meta conversations
No.39009
dumb argumentative shitposter
No.39010
>>38998>It is disillusioning to post alongside such a poster because I would rather not associate with a poster who makes it part of their identity that they make kuso posts. Why? Well, why wouldn't that be the case? If this were a forum for animal lovers, would it not strike you as distasteful, off-putting, and questionable if there was a board for euthanasia and abuse?It is somewhat disillusioning that people aren't the perfect posters you envision, but I accept that as I prefer to understand the entirety of people, quirks and all, and accept their existence as a separate individual. However, this example is far too extreme a comparison to say that the kuso behavior of some is equatable to animal abuse on an animal lovers site. On one hand you can say that the personality of some people and their tastes are far below the high bar of expectations you set. On the other what you have is people who delight and praise the suffering of the very thing you come to cherish on the site. /secret/ is not entirely antithetical to the rest of kissu by engaging in actions that contradict everything the site stands for, it's just the stream of conscious diarrhea of a few. I can tolerate people having kuso opinions or politics as long as I don't have to see it all the time. I could not tolerate the promotion of abuse on a site for loving animals. That line for me would be more if /secret/ were engaging in drama stalking and cliquish behavior trying to force an in-group or harm onto others, which it is in no way doing.
You made a comparison to #jp and #qa, and I'd say that #jp is far worse towards #qa than /secret/ is to the rest of kissu. What happens in #jp has often leaked much more into #qa, causing spam raids or worse, while /secret/ has stayed sealed off for nearly its entire existence. Only affecting those who choose to deliberately come here hoping for something better. I think that's where your real disappointment lies, since I remember in the past you trying to argue for a better /secret/ that actually held a positive purpose. But I disagree with that mindset entirely, I don't think /secret/ should have to exist on a site that we made for ourselves if we're abiding by normal 4/qa/ standards. Yet as I alluded to in
>>39006 there was a time I felt that way which is why I made my meta threads for the softening of restrictions on /jp/ and later the use of /secret/ as a funposting outlet. And I used it that way for a good while. But now I believe there's no need for that because I can once again post on the rest of the site as I would back when I'd post on 4/qa/, there's a fair bit of funposts on /jp/ right now that I'd have posted in the past on /secret/ instead because they're slightly edgy and I used to feel that anything even remotely unsanitary I couldn't post on kissu proper. The only thing that does keep /secret/ even remotely useful, aside from the meta conversation, is containing the drivel some anons can't help but post. And I'd rather they post to an empty void than somewhere I care about.
>To endorse, by virtue of existence, that which is directly at odds with the broader ideology of the site IS disillusioning to the highest degree. If others have character faults by virtue of the distasteful posts they make, they should be easily mitigatible by not providing an outlet for them here. Public drunkenness is distasteful, so there are laws against public consumption; if kuso posts are distasteful, then why is the outlet for them here, when they could just as easily be anywhere else? There is nothing which inherently compels them here, but the fact that they are here is disillusioning!Public drunkenness is distasteful, but this is not public drunkenness. This is a locked room in the cellar of a bar where the people are all shitfaced drunk. You know there's people from the regular floor coming down here, and you know you can't get in without the key, yet you go and retrieve the key from the bartender to go down into it and the smell of vomit and the unintelligible or crude ramblings of those in the cellar disgust you. You see some people you know from there that are regulars at the bar and you start to think less of them, but when you see them again outside that cellar they're still quite civilized and acting on their best behavior. Sure, you know that there's another side to some of the patrons, but the extent of what you know is that they're sometimes unruly and disgusting behind closed doors. They're not doing anything harmful or morally reprehensible that you'd feel the need to call the authorities on them for, and they still act normally when they're not in the cellar. After a few weeks of having seen the cellar you're still in the bar and feel in good company while avoiding the cellar, while seeing some of them go to the cellar and knowing the condition of that area, but you haven't gone there and can come to accept that some of them just like to go and be a deviant in the cellar. Also if I wanted to make an analogy to #qa, it's still owned by the bar and operates on the top floor where the normal bar manager doesn't come to. Nothing changes about you going to the bar or not, you just somehow can't stand that you can see the hallway leading downstairs in the main bar.
No.39012
>>39010In fact that analogy is even worse than the reality because you can't even see on kissu who's going in and out of the cellar, in fact you can pretty much ignore people going to /secret/ entirely if you want to. Maybe it'd be better to say that the entrance to the cellar is cut off from the main floor as well, you need to go outside and into the cellar through the locked entrance just like you do the top floor (#qa). There's literally nothing forcing you to see either entrance, and there's still regulars who go to the cellar that come to the top floor too.
There's no point to any of this and you keep getting upset about the cellar for no reason while using the opposite top floor. It's stupid and I will stand by it being stupid.
No.39013
>>39010>I don't think /secret/ should have to exist on a site that we made for ourselves if we're abiding by normal 4/qa/ standards. To elaborate, I think that kissu is already hidden enough in terms of being a lesser known site on the web. To have a board that carries a positive impact being hidden is just a waste of time and effort because the exposure and potential positive impact a post on
any other board could have is far greater. To have anything further hidden would just run the risk of developing into a circlejerk that makes funposts for only themselves and doesn't care about expanding at all. Maybe my mindset differs from the norm here in that I
do want Kissu to grow beyond the initial userbase and develop something of its own in the future so we can carve out a good chunk for ourselves that promotes what we'd like to see on the web. And to good degree, we have done that over the years. But to keep that progress going I need to address all the problems that face the site in this endeavor, and /secret/'s existence is a solution to one of those problems that can't be fixed. The second problem is people feeling like they need to come to /secret/, and no, you don't. People shouldn't feel compelled to ever come here or have any expectations for it. There's nothing important or useful about this board, and nobody should ever think there will be.
The disillusionment is only an issue if you make it to be one. Realize that the population of kissu is far greater than the handful of people that post on /secret/ and ignore it for good.
No.39014
>>38998>/secret/ is the exact opposite: It says, "yes, kuso posts and kuso posters are welcome here, they're so welcome we'll move them here for you to continue your kuso discussions"If it wasn't obvious from my extremely long tirade of posts, I'm going to completely stop that practice from here on out. As it relates to my other point about the usefulness of /secret/ having worn out. All I really need to do is get Cool on board and then it will never happen again, and I think if anything Cool was just waiting for me to agree so there's nothing to get in our way.
I do want to find a way to address issues like the one tirade Anon or people that get a bit too controversial with what people are fine with, but the seasonal boards can probably contain all that like they used to. And the rest can go straight to /trans/, like it should.
No.39015
>>39013Thanks I'm gonna delete /secret/ from my browser history. I never gain anything from opening this board.
No.39016
>>39005As
>>39007 said it was made on whim for a joke and just stuck around. Its main purpose became to host meta talk (although people should really use /b/ for that) and threads that people consciously choose to be here because they don't want to bother others. It used to be that anything remotely controversial was on the seasonal boards, like talk of covid, but instead stuff can be done here. There was a spike in activity during the start of the Ukraine war since it was a serious thing that many people were very concerned about.
My main issue of secret is when people make good threads here like
>>38946 or
>>38900 because they are basically made here to die without interaction, a thread made for 5% of people to see. It seems like someone else made that point already in this thread.
>>39014I'm fine with no longer moving threads here, but that's sort of been my compromise to exercising my will to squash sins against kissu culture. The last thread I moved here was about "credit card kikes" and my instinct tells me to delete such threads, but I've been dealing with heavy pushback this year for deleting such things.
No.39019
hey i was reading that
No.39022
To provide insight on how I as a hack refugee came to understand the board: Every time I saw /secret/ mentioned on /all/, it was always openly regarded as the trash can of the site, a catch-all for non-toxic low quality posts, which is why I started to think of it as some sort of pre-porn 4/b/ and find it hard to fault the people smearing feces everywhere, even if I myself don't like the majority of posts like modern YT videos and politics at all. It's this effect of "people will adapt to what they see (is allowed)", though this is not meant as an excuse but just to show how other people might've interpreted the board as well.
I don't have an opinion on the future of the board because I think everyone makes good points for keeping / killing / changing it, I just think it's interesting there's something happening here.
No.39023
>>39010>this example is far too extreme a comparison to say that the kuso behavior of some is equatable to animal abuse on an animal lovers site.The example is
irrelevant. The point is the lack of any ideological consistency such contrast entails.
>You made a comparison to #jp and #qa, and I'd say that #jp is far worse towards #qa than /secret/ is to the rest of kissu. What happens in #jp has often leaked much more into #qa, causing spam raids or worse, while /secret/ has stayed sealed off for nearly its entire existence.The difference is that moderation on #qa is visible, whereas moderation on Kissu is invisible. When someone broaches unwelcome topics on #qa, they get told off and kicked and/or banned and told to take those posts somewhere else. The same cannot be said for Kissu (re: "this happened too long ago", "it was ignored and didn't derail", etc.), and especially not for /secret/.
>This is a locked room in the cellar of a bar where the people are all shitfaced drunk. You know there's people from the regular floor coming down here, and you know you can't get in without the key, yet you go and retrieve the key from the bartender to go down into it and the smell of vomit and the unintelligible or crude ramblings of those in the cellar disgust you.To extend the metaphor, the bar kicked the problem drunks out and there wasn't any problem for a long time. Some time later, the proprietor of the bar opened an invite only model train club down in the cellar, but at some point the proprietor of the bar would start coming into the train club absolutely plastered and combative. The train club gradually stopped meeting, and then the problem drunks who had long since not made any trouble found out about the proprietor's behavior and decided to start coming into the cellar to join him. Every now and then some of the former train club members find the cellar empty and try to reorganize things. At times, the train club seems to be meeting just like they used to, but then unpredictably the bar proprietor comes in, pushes the train tables to the walls and proceeds to piss and vomit all over the floor, sometimes finding himself joined by some problem drunks too. And the cycle repeats. The proprietor thinks nothing of this. It's his cellar after all. And, really, why do those train club people keep coming into the cellar?
>Also if I wanted to make an analogy to #qa, it's still owned by the bar and operates on the top floor where the normal bar manager doesn't come to.If we continue the metaphor... #qa and #jp are separate establishments with separate management. The bartender at #qa is no nonsense and tells problem drunks to get the fuck out and not come back if they're going to behave the way they do, and if they can't help themselves, go down the block to #jp where they are tolerated.
There's no ideological inconsistency for a patron of #jp to occasionally peruse #qa so long as they abide by the #qa code of conduct when visiting the #qa bar. There is ideological inconsistency for the proprietor of the Kissu bar to not tolerate problem drunks upstairs and then direct them into the cellar where the train club meets.
>I can tolerate people having kuso opinions or politics as long as I don't have to see it all the time.I cannot. Why?... Because this was litigated in the past and I still hold the exact same belief as I did then. See:
https://archive.is/2AHi4Quoting myself:
¥Personally, I can't control myself. I'd much rather occasionally be banned for a few days for stepping out of line than inadvertently instigate conflict at every avenue as I've been doing it seems...I think this is the most poignant thought that still resounds today:
¥Would it perhaps be unfair for all political opinions to be censored? Yes, but at that point, the only people being alienated are those who cannot stop themselves from always bringing up politics.What do you do when the proprietor of the bar is one who cannot help himself?
I still care a great deal about politics and keep up with the news. Do I post about that stuff on Kissu or /secret/ or even #qa? No. I do not, because I firmly believe that if my behavior and desires are at odds with someone else's enjoyment, then I should contain myself and find avenues of expression elsewhere, where I am not a bother.
The fact that there is one prominent individual and maybe others, who in spite of all of the past litigation, still insist they need a space for their worst behavior is the height of selfishness and I cannot in good faith ever agree with this line of thinking you are suggesting. To just tolerate seeing kuso posts occasionally.
No.39025
>>39023And, uh... sorry to keep extending the metaphor, but I actually like it a lot.
As a former train club member, I confide in a bartender at the Kissu bar. The bartender tells me he can't do anything about the proprietor. But, he does say that I'm free to try kicking the problem drunks out of the cellar in just as combative a manner as the proprietor casts aside the train club's belongings. So, I don a gas mask and bring some pepper spray and pepper spray the fuck out of the problem drunks. There's so much pepper spray in the air that it even dissuades train club members from coming back... Then the proprietor comes down, says "cut that out or you're banned from the bar upstairs" in less friendly terms. So what is a former train club member to do? The bartenders think the pepper spray idea works, even though it always ends in the proprietor throwing a fit.
Some time passes and now the bartenders think its a lost cause. "You can try the pepper spray idea again if you want..." one of them says. The other thinks its time to get the city to declare the cellar a safety hazard, and have it permanently barred closed so no one can get in. Myself, a train club member, find the situation's long drawn out nature so exhausting that by association I hardly patronize the bar upstairs any longer. I used to go daily, made art to spruce up the place, held community events like game nights and movie watches. But now it's all so bitter. These are the people I'm associating with? Sure, the patrons are still the same as ever, although with a bit of a change in demographics, but they're enjoyable to be around. But the building itself just exudes a bad aura that makes you want to stop coming altogether even if you do occasionally find yourself popping in daily for weeks at a time, and other times not stopping in for weeks or months at a time.
So where have I been spending my time? Well, the #qa bar is managed by one of the bartenders of the Kissu bar, which does have its own occasionally frustrating conflicts of interest that have now mostly been resolved, but nevertheless it's a more relaxed environment that makes an effort to not let itself become anything even approaching what that cellar represented.
No.39026
I think what /secret/ needed was, paradoxically, more moderation.
It serves as a good example of the ultimate powerlessness of the community against persistently problematic individuals. There was a nice thing going on, a space for the raunchier exchanges that people agreed were more like 4/qa/ and would be nice to return to, a place where the decorum of the rest of the site didn't apply precisely because of its hiddenness, and the idea that everything went. There was hope, it was spoken of in very positive terms by those that now bemoan it. But with the Hasan and youtubeposting saga, despite overwhelmingly pushing against Vermineux' zero-effort, no-interest slop barrage and all the drama it caused, the community proved unable to defeat this spammer because the stance for moderation was that nothing but the most egregious violations were to be deleted, even if there was wide agreement that this sucked, which eroded interest in the board because nobody gives a flying fuck about V's recommendations that he has a pathological need to repost before even watching them. In this way, it was yet another case showing that total freedom doesn't work and moderation is always needed to ensure the community can continue to function.
It also doesn't help that the other gentleman repeatedly spammed the fuck out of the board whenever he threw a tantrum, which most of the time achieved either absolutely nothing at all or contributed towards killing the fun.
No.39029
>>39028Your position is that the things you dislike should be deleted. My position is that things which the community dislikes should be deleted.
No.39031
>>39030I didn't endorse it when inoffensive threads got spammed to death, so probably not.
No.39034
In this set of metaphors I didn't even know /secret/ was supposed to be like a nice model train club at first and I think I was there fairly early on...
No.39035
>>39034It's not just you, I'd never describe /secret/ as having been anything close to a model train club. I think Anonymous clearly glorifies old /secret/ way too much and that's why his disappointment is so disproportionate to the situation at hand.
No.39037
>>39035I knew he was a faggot.
No.39038
The problem with v isn't that he's into streamers and political pig slop, it's that he's a leftist. If he was into right wing internet detritus that would be great, thanks.
No.39039
True and based
No.39041
/secret/ is staying because if it doesn't I'll go back to being a GNFOS poster or worse.
No.39045
>>39043Americans are trying to get us angry despite being better.
Same things as always
No.39050
>>39034If I remember right... It was first brought up on #qa, something like this "did you guys get your $1M in BTC from the millionaire Anon on /secret/?" At first, it was just a joke. There wasn't a /secret/ board. And then it was made and was somewhat like a slower, more lax /jp/ without needing spoilers for NSFW. Pic related was one of the first threads, to which I obviously replied: "kimo".
I believe the first outside reference to /secret/ was verm moving a gun thread from /jp/ that started talking about revolutionary guerilla tactics wherein he sperged out and said he wouldn't allow talk about overthrowing the government and threatened to ban the people in the thread. The move to /secret/ killed the thread even though he said the discussion to continue there. After that, it started becoming more of a policy to move undesirable threads from the seasonal boards to /secret/, and meta threads from /qa/. Pretty often threads would go /qa/ or /jp/ -> move to seasonal board -> thread deleted, but continued on /trans/ -> move to /secret/. Those thread moves weren't so bad in retrospect because they were one-offs that fizzled out and then /secret/ threads would push it off the first page. But then Ukraine happened and there was a constant stream of politics and war updates, drowning out anything else. A few /secret/ posts a day couldn't compete with dozens of posts per day, and handfuls of threads every week. "Politics is banned, why is this allowed on /secret/" -> "I cannot delete it, but if you want you can try spamming them". So /secret/ gets spammed, pushing /secret/ threads and politics threads alike off the catalog. The /secret/ threads didn't really recover, but the politics didn't stop. Months later it finally did, but /secret/ was ravaged and nothing like it was. Then it started getting used to post garbage threads: reaction youtubers, teen memes, any bottom of the barrel slop you can imagine -- and it's more or less been that way ever since. But, occasionally there are interruptions where the kuso posts take a backseat. Cool started taking a more active role and would do custom CSS, name changes, custom rules (all posts MUST mention Kuon), and so forth. I enjoyed that. Now /secret/ is... I don't know. Cool seems to have stepped back, and the kuso posts seem to be increasing in number again...
No.39056
So, what now exactly, was the recent purge just a one-off? I don't mean this as condescending as it might sound, but to put it directly the way I'm interpreting this thread, Verniy is too addicted to stop posting his YT stuff on here and others understandably don't wanna fuck him over, so things are planned to continue the same way as before?
No.39059
>>39057Thank you, sounds good to me! Not my preferred outcome personally, but I think it's fair considering others are granted the same freedom on here.
No.39065
>>39051What did you want me to think and say after having read this?
>>39032I have so many thoughts swirling around that I simply cannot reply to this post because of how broad and rhetorical it is. It would be a wasted effort to go through yet another Kissu folk history, covering events that happened years ago, to demonstrate a point about character, and why I think that's important, and why I think the things I think when I know that nothing will come of having posted it. There cannot even be made an argument that posting would be beneficial to those that might be interested in Kissu's history since they will never see it due to the subject at hand. So what would be the point in saying anything? You will not read what I say in any depth, having come to a conclusion already, and no one will read what I have to say, and I will find no enjoyment either in recounting distasteful past events.
So why have you asked anything of me to consider? The result would be the same if I said nothing at all.
No.39068
>>39065What I'm asking you to consider is just giving up on this board and treating it as though it's been deleted. I don't know why you're so fucking insistent on this board being a thing. I don't want it to be a thing, Vern wants it to be his thing. There's an ENTIRE rest of Kissu to care about. Why should I waste any effort on /secret/ or remove it so that its removal can go on to cause problems for the rest of the site? Should I have vern change the name so that you can't navigate here so easily anymore? What will it take for you to just give up on this fucking board already?
No.39069
Your pointless musings and spiraling woe over what's really such a trivial matter serve no purpose other than to make your own self more dissatisfied and disillusioned so you can justify whatever argument you're going to make. Why? Why can't you just accept my single concession to Vern for the sake of peace on the rest of Kissu? It makes no sense from any logical standpoint unless you think the moral offense against the site itself is so severe that Kissu cannot function with this board existing, but that's blatantly not true because Kissu is doing great from a glance at the catalog. So what's your point?
These theatrics bordering on concern trolling are extremely annoying.
No.39072
>>39068>>39069You said a bunch of things, but I don't think you really want a reply to any of it.
>Should I have vern change the name so that you can't navigate here so easily anymore? Add an IP-based redirect to the 404 page so that only IPs within verm's immediate geographic area can access /secret/.
>These theatrics bordering on concern trolling are extremely annoying.OP's thread was mostly off-topic replies when I replied. All I did initially was agree with them and that spawned the barrage of
>>38984 >>38985 >>38986 >>38987 >>38988 >>38989 >>38990.
If it would make you happier, I'll make brief unaccountable low quality complaints instead, so they won't be seen as "concern trolling" due to their length and scope.
verm can't help himself with politics and slop and I can't help myself with replying earnestly to meta. Shoot me.
No.39075
>>39065I think you're being overbearing and demanding so many concessions that it borders of subservience.
You've said something in the past that you like to let off steam by creating long rants, which denigrates the people or culture here, even if you know you're asking the impossible or at least being extremely unreasonable. That's fine, I guess, since older kissu people can identify it for what it is and we've been through this same song and dance many times. But it's painting a negative picture of kissu to the newer people that have made posts in this very thread in confusion. They're taking things at face value and can't comprehend this guy preaching the death of kissu because a hidden containment board, like 0.2% of kissu activity, isn't the way he wants it.
I can relate to your feelings of alienation, but there are limits to what you can reasonably expect from people.
No.39076
>>39072Would it make you feel better if we just IP blocked you from /secret/ so you don't have to see it? Since you can't seem to help yourself from viewing what's obviously making you feel terrible for some reason.
No.39079
>>39060Make a new hidden board called /kuso/, move the bad threads there and let it be a containment board. Let /secret/ be
>>39078, or delete it and move it's activity to a non-hidden board; either the seasonal boards to give them purpose or a new one.
No.39080
You're asking me to do CSS stuff and events, but I really don't have the motivation these days so I wouldn't make a board or do any changes to kissu with the expectation that I would. Maybe in a few months/years after I have time to sort things through my brain or something. Well, I guess the other staff can do it, though.
No.39081
We should all get a Switch 2 and play games and have fun together to make a stand against Verniy, who's with me? Imagine the look on his face.
No.39083
>>39081I prefer Mario Kart 8. Also the Switch 2 is way too expensive...
No.39084
>>39083Does this mean you will play with me if I ever decide to get that one?
No.39087
>>39084Yeah, sure. The DLC is mostly worth getting for it. I'm not a fan of some of the DLC's tracks though. A bunch of them, particularly the "Tour" tracks, have this gimmick where it's the same track each lap, but the path you take through it changes. It's a neat idea, but a lot of those tracks feel less creative and detailed because of it. Like, in the base game, there are tracks that change each lap, like Bowser's Castle, and linear tracks like Mount Wario, and I like those. But with the changing path ones, they become more grid-like to accommodate intersections from changing paths. Nothing about the tracks change, there's just red barriers that prevent you from going the wrong way once you finish a lap.
Personally, my favorite tracks are probably the Animal Crossing one, because the foliage changes with the time of year (like snow in the winter, falling leaves in the autumn) and bells instead of coins, Yoshi's Island, which has a toggleable path if you drive into a floating thing through one of the flying sections, and Mount Wario.
No.39088
>>39087That sounds great to me so far, I don't think I'd even really mind the gimmicky tracks you mentioned, coming from MKW I'd probably just be happy to see any track with laps. Outside of obviously flawed ones like Baby Park, maybe. What I'd definitely miss are the new mechanics from MKW, like wall-riding, which I feel improved on the formula a ton and is the primary reason I'm trying to get people to pay half a grand for the game.
I will ask in the Kart thread if I do get 8, it mostly depends on the releases there are because of my physical-only mentality, so I will check what the most complete version is, what I'd still be missing with that one and if I could get it at a good price.
No.39090
>>39089I should add: the case is misleading. The DLC is included on the cartridge itself, not just a DLC code in the case.
No.39091
>>39071Wouldn't it being a disgust response from seeing things you don't like make more sense? You see this behavior on twitter or any social media site, and they're not anonymous.
No.39094
I just realized that I don't have enough space for all I want to put on my home server and it's pissing me off so I want to get a different one, and I can probably put as much into this as I would a new car since my bank's looking ok for now and I want someone creative with this stuff to help me out and you have to do all this gay meta shit instead.
No.39096
Ahhh, it'd be so cool to put my entire anime library on Jellyfin and then watch anime together with my kissu friends easily without issue ahhhh I want to do so much fun stuff but I can't because everyone wants to fling shit and be dicks instead.
No.39097
Vern would understand maybe I don't know maybe this is what someone else wants I just want to chill out on the internet and enjoy my anime until the end of time on a well backed up server...
No.39098
Legitimately give me the 2gbps internet I have now and some more storage (like 160tb or so maybe, I'm thinking 8x22tb WD Gold or maybe more aahhhh but then it's really only 6x22tb so I need 12x22tb WD Gold and weeeeee that's already like over $9000
No.39099
hope black friday sale is good then I can maybe get the drives from microcenter for around 7k with an extra 5% off via the card
No.39101
>>39098Unless you cannot afford the electricity cost of more drives, more smaller drives will always be safer than fewer larger drives. One of the biggest dangers is having a disk fail, the RAID array needing to be rebuilt, and having a second or third drive fail during the resilvering period where the computer is recalculating parity and reading from ALL disks at once to re-write to the disk needing to be replaced. Naturally, this is very stressful on your drives. For a 22TB drive, that means your drives will be pegged for over 2 whole days; 22 TB / 125MB/s = 2 days, 53 minutes. Realistically, it will be longer due to file random access unless you take the array offline. If you have a weak CPU, it can also take significantly longer because recalculating parity is very CPU heavy.
The way to mitigate this is, unfortunately, more drives and/or more fault-tolerant RAID layouts. Personally, I wouldn't create a RAID VDEV any wider than 6 drives, and I wouldn't create a RAID vdev with any lower redundancy than RAIDz2 (2-disk fault tolerance per vdev). What you lose in storage efficiency, you gain in fault tolerance. More or less... The thing to keep in mind is that if you stripe across vdev's, you don't intrinsically gain more fault tolerance. It really depends where in the pool the drive fails. e.g. You have 4 vdevs, each RAIDz2 with 4 disks total; you could "in theory" lose 2*4 drives, but the worst-case scenario is that you lose 3 drives on the same vdev, in which case the pool becomes dead and irrecoverable because you have lost the parity to reconstruct it. If you mirror vdevs, you can lose an entire vdev, but you lose a whole lot of storage efficiency (<50% storage efficiency).
If you can tolerance the noise, heat output, electricity cost, and space... I would recommend getting a used server rack. 20U or greater is good. Don't buy new. New server racks are insanely expensive. <20U there are lots of short-depth, wall-mount networking racks that don't really disclose that they're not full-depth (>=32 inches post-to-post depth) unless you know what they look like. People seem to recommend the Startech open post, adjustable server racks, but if you plan on putting a lot in them, I'm not sure I would trust them.
Then, buy a NetApp DS4243 or NetApp DS4246. They're identical.They both accept 24x SAS/SATA 3.5" drives. The DS4243 can often be found slightly cheaper. Then, in the back, you can replace the SAS controller to either SAS6 or SAS12. The DS4243 uses an IOM3 SAS controller (i.e., the SAS lanes are 3Gb/s). DS4246 uses an IOM6. There's also an IOM12, but it's a bit pricy. Unless you're doing SSDs, you probably don't need an IOM12. Each external SAS is 4 SAS lanes. The controllers have 2 external SAS, so you max out at 3*2*4 (24Gb/s) with the IOM3, 6*2*4 (48Gb/s) with the IOM6, and 12*2*4 (96Gb/s) with the IOM12. HDDs top out at 250MB/s to begin with, so with 24 disks, you won't see any improvement with the IOM12 unless you use SSDs.
If you want an SSD array, consider the NetApp DS2246. It accepts 24x SAS/SATA 2.5" drives.
Also, when considering a SAN like either of the above, consider the PCIe generation of the HBA you're going to use. For 24x SATA SSDs, you would have a theoretical max bandwidth of 14.4GB/s. Many HBAs are x8, and PCIe 3.0 x8 maxes out a 7.8GB/s, for reference. For HDDs, it's kind of a moot point because 24x HDDs (really good ones) would have a max bandwidth of 6GB/s, which easily falls within PCIe 3.0 x8. You could also do PCIe 2.0 x16. Also, absolutely do NOT put server PCIe cards in a typical PC case. Desktop PC fans will NOT push enough air to cool the cards, and you will significantly shorten their lifespan.
No.39103
>>39101I'm going to be giving some input to my father on how to design the server room we have for the next house, what would you recommend for an ideal setup so that I can keep it properly cooled even in the summer?
No.39104
Also if there's a big enough sale for black friday/cyber monday maybe I will just buy a 24 pack of WD 24tb golds.
No.39105
>>39103>how to design the server roomIt really, REALLY depends what all you're planning on doing. Whether you plan on having a full 42U rack, or even a full ~20U rack, or if you just plan on having a room full of miscellaneous desktops and stuff.
If it's later, and the room has a window, a standard window AC unit will probably suffice.
If it's the former... Quite honestly, if you can afford the monthly cost, and your data doesn't absolutely need to be on-premise, I would strongly encourage you to look at
local co-location datacenters. Most provide a controlled access environment with everything needed on-site, including racks, networking, environmental monitoring, clean filtered air, and whole-site UPS (i.e. the site will not lose power if there's a blackout). Most even have on-site techs if you need someone to run to your server and restart it; if you trust them, you can usually leave stuff like replacement drives in a caged area if a drive fails so a tech can replace them for you.
But... If it absolutely must be on-premise, I would start by recommending running 240V to the room. 240V breakers allow for greater amperage and will allow you to run more than 1440W worth of equipment (for continuous loads, you should only draw 4/5 of the breaker trip current, so 120V at 12A instead of full 15A the breaker is rated for). 240V PSUs are also more efficient, so there will be less non-compute heat production. After that, consider plumbing placement. If you live somewhere pipes freeze, putting your server cabinet beneath a water line might not be the greatest idea. As far as cooling goes, you probably want a dedicated mini split AC system; for sizing, consider your estimated electricity usage in watts -- you can convert watts to BTU by dividing watts by 0.293. e.g. 2500W / 0.293 = 8530 BTU, then bump up to the next available size so your AC isn't struggling to cool the room or maintain temperature. Also, keep in mind heating from the sun, whether there's shade during certain times of day, and so forth. An unshaded exterior wall will contribute greatly to the heating of the room depending on time of day.
If you plan on going crazy with a full 42U rack, you should really only install the server rack where you know that floor is capable of supporting the weight of the rack and all of the equipment inside. If it's going to be full of servers, you may want to locate it in the basement on the concrete slab. I very much doubt residential timber frame construction is designed for holding >1000 lbs in a ~4ft x 2ft footprint. Also, put the leveling feet down once the rack is in place. It's not good to leave a rack resting on the casters when loaded because you can deform the rubber wheels and put a flat spot into them and then it won't roll properly (or at all depending on how loaded it is) when you need to move it.
No.39106
i don't think he has any idea what he'd even do with a 20U
No.39108
I'd be fine with sharing it with others who share a similar end goal to myself so we could all use it on kissu, naturally that'd probably include yourself, me, cool, vern, and anyone else I think would find use from it who wouldn't fuck me over. A madokami for kissu of sorts (21.40T used, 52.65T free plenty of space). But for now, my goal is to be able to completely isolate myself from anything I don't own and hoard my terabytes upon terabytes of otaku media. I'd host a Jellyfin server on it for one, SSH into it to watch stuff on my PC as well, Vern's probably right that I don't know exactly what I'd do to fill a whole 20U, but I do get more ideas by the day.
Would probably migrate the kissu server into that too, as a properly built thing as I learn more about SSH and such, since I realized I don't really need a normal PC to do this stuff and maybe by the time I get it all set up and running and this house is sold the 60 series will be out by then and I can get a running dual-60 series gpu for cool. Need to learn how to hack my smart TV or something to get rid of all the bloat... but maybe by the time I've separated my TV and PC I won't need to do that, doubt it though.
Colo is a business expense unless I'm an actual millionaire, so I won't be doing that. I expect maybe a $1k-$2k cost of cooling it per year depending on the price of energy. But if energy prices go up, I'm also doing well, so that's not too much of a worry. Although would I want the server room to be above ground or in the basement? Surely there must be a good way of naturally alleviating a lot of the necessary cooling I'd need to do through primarily AC. If any one of you does have some good ideas for this in the future and/or ways to make the server more expandable in the future if needed with all sorts of neat things, I wouldn't be too against having a kissu server room in general. Or maybe for something really futuristic that will 100% not happen we could have the servers set up in Northern Canada with Vermin attending to it using the heat from the server as house heating. (of course this'd never happen and even if it did I doubt we'd get a good connection out of it and I want to have my servers available to me 24/7.)
Reading the posts over again... if I were to theoretically get 24 HDDs, would you then suggest 8 of them be used for backup? Say one 24 partition with 8 backup or 4 partitions with 2 backups each. After I get the new house and the server all I really need are a source of food for myself, likely chickens and fruit, and then maybe water and I can call myself mostly self-sufficient and live off the rest of my savings until I die maybe improving the server all the while.
No.39109
Well that won't do, this thread needs to bump.
No.39111
>>39110Assuming I get the server set up now, at least come black friday, what would you say a good plan for cooling this would be?
No.39113
I want to say
>>>/qa/164247>>>/qa/164253Fuck you. You're
still a rude piece of garbage despite kissu culture changing to accommodate your rude antagonistic style of shitting over everyone or anything they enjoy. God forbid there's any place on the internet having any degree of sincerity to it where people could be themselves without
you barging in the door to say "cringe". I no longer show any hint of vulnerability here because I know there are vultures here like you eager to judge and attack. I've dismissed reports because people report your antagonistic posts for disrupting threads, but I don't take action because people find it overbearing for a mod to enforce a culture of reciprocal kindness where people enjoy being around each other.
And yet here you in that post, a
VICTIM that's being oppressed by my desire to block the promotion of your heroes and turn the thread into a cesspit where you would feel more at home.
Maybe I shouldn't have made this post since my desperate lack of sleep has removed some of my inhibitions, but I felt like I needed to finally share my honest opinion on something.
No.39114
>>39113>Maybe I shouldn't have made this post since my desperate lack of sleep has removed some of my inhibitions, but I felt like I needed to finally share my honest opinion on something.It's OK, I prefer to know such things.
From this reaction I have no idea whether you've been mod-stalking my posts by IP or not. Maybe you are not, because your post reads as if you're making a bunch of unwarranted extrapolations from two of my more antagonistic posts and assuming that's my normal style. (thinking that such and such persons are my "heroes" for example, that's just not there in my posts at all). But maybe you are, because you mention my posts getting reported, though this could be just you matching the IP that is being reported to the latest post. Could you give examples of reported posts?
I don't think I have a rude antagonistic style of shitting over everyone or anything they enjoy.
No.39115
>>39114I'm not IP stalking, I know your posting style and the way you instantly go back to wojaks and how you feel I'm ruining your fun when you can't post your blatant cultural sins here (yet).
(and we don't have mod logs going back years anyway)
No.39116
>>39115>I know your posting style and the way you instantly go back to wojaks and how you feel I'm ruining your funAnd I know yours, you are catastrophizing. My position on woyc
[s |][/s]ucks: I think woyacks are funny but I'm OK with not posting them on kissu and neither feel oppressed by that rule of kissu's, nor by your ever-burning hatred of them.
No.39117
>>39116Well, at least we see eye-to-eye in knowing we'll never see eye-to-eye and represent entirely opposing views and values.
No.39118
>>39117I don't think the misalignment is 180 degrees.
Still waiting on examples of my antagonistic posts that disrupt threads.
No.39119
>>39108>I don't know exactly what I'd do to fill a whole 20UIt's easier than you think. UPS easily takes up 2-4U, a DS4246 takes up 4U, a rack PDU takes up 1U, a network switch takes up 1U, and a typical server takes up 2U. That's 10-12U right there.
>Need to learn how to hack my smart TV or something to get rid of all the bloat...You could always get an old fashioned Android stick.
>would I want the server room to be above ground or in the basement?Depends how much you'll put in it and your environment. Where I live, basements have a tendency to flood, so I would personally go for above ground. Many people put their server rack in their garage, but garages typically have some of the worst insulation and if you park your car there... For a simple 10-12U setup like mentioned above, you shouldn't have any concerns about putting it on upstairs floor. It's really once you start getting more than 15-20U that weight becomes a genuine point of consideration.
>if I were to theoretically get 24 HDDs, would you then suggest 8 of them be used for backup? Say one 24 partition with 8 backup or 4 partitions with 2 backups each.I would personally do a stripe across 4x 6-wide VDEVs, each at RAIDz2. That would give you 66% storage efficiency, with 2-disk fault tolerance per VDEV. Basically, the usable capacity would be 16 drives worth, with 8 dedicated to parity. So, if you really plan on getting 24TB drives, that would give you 384TB of usable capacity. If you're alright with not using every disk in the storage array, you may like the concept of a "hot spare"; If you populate the array with drives, but don't add them to the RAID pool for storage, you can set them as a "hot spare" so that if a drive dies, it instantly replaces the failed drive so you don't have to check your alerts, find out a drive has died, figure out how to flash the LED to locate the failed drive, and then manually swap it out.
You can mess around with different RAID configurations on
this website.
>>39110Since that was in a theatre room, check the distance from the front edge of the front post, to the rear edge of the rear post. AV racks use different dimensions than server racks. The width is standardized for pretty much everything rackable, but the post-to-post distance changes for... reasons. For servers, you generally want 29 inch depth to be safe.
>>39111>what would you say a good plan for cooling this would be?You haven't really said what the server's specs are, so... But, with just the NetApp DS4246, that would be ~220W idle and ~270W under load. Assuming whatever PC it's hooked up to consumes ~230W, your home AC may be able to effectively cool the room, assuming you have good air circulation.
I guess if you want to do something stupid and fun, Tripp Lite sells an in-rack AC unit that blows cool air over the intakes of your servers. You need to set up ducting for it, which they sell a kit for. It just uses plastic flexible tubing, similar to a clothes dryer, then you could just exhaust the air out a window or something. Just make sure it's covered on the outside so stuff like rain and bugs don't get inside.
No.39120
With 384 TB of storage space, maybe you could host a portion of usenet files on that thing.
No.39121
>>39118I linked two of them here
>>39113 but you're trying to goad me into scanning your IP history which I have no desire to.
No.39123
Although I guess if you're rich you could just run the gas lines through an exterior wall and place the compressor on the outside instead of having it strapped to the top like a horrific appendage.
No.39124
>>39121I'm not trying to goad you, I'm asking you explicitly to do it.
Ok, fine, you don't want to do it. Then
>You're still a rude piece of garbage despite kissu culture changing to accommodate your rude antagonistic style of shitting over everyone or anything they enjoy. God forbid there's any place on the internet having any degree of sincerity to it where people could be themselves without you barging in the door to say "cringe". I no longer show any hint of vulnerability here because I know there are vultures here like you eager to judge and attack.is just you bitching about those two particular posts (which I've already said were more antagonistic than my usual) with no real evidence you're willing to provide that other people see my typical posts as a problem. And whatever posts you're blaming me for are likely false attributions since you're not able to think straight when someone even so much as brings up woy soijaks just to use them for a metaphor or simile. No, he's public enemy number one, your personal nemesis from the soy site.
What about all the occasions where kissuers felt comfortable showing a high degree of vulnerability and they didn't get attacked over it, neither by me nor by other people? Over in
>>28268 an anon has been documenting his attempts to write fiction as well as talking about loved ones dying. People are supportive regarding the latter. Over in
>>34087 an anon talked about doing stuff that anywhere else would get him excoriated, but here, we understood his feelings.
No.39128
>>38952In the little I've browsed /secret/, it feels like kissu's version of /pol/. Although I'd prefer that it didn't exist outright, at least it's hidden away so the rest of the site doesn't become like this.
No.39140
>>39119>For servers, you generally want 29 inch depth to be safe.Just measured it out today, it's got 29 inch depth. Luckily seems like my father splurged on it when he initially designed this house so I'm saved one purchase.
No.39142
Actually, after thinking about it for a couple days I think I'm going to take a break from kissu for a bit. I'll still respond to illegal reports, but like the 4/qa/ days it's building up my stress too much and I'm at the point in my life where I want to do everything I can to avoid cortisol increases in my blood. I think I'll catch up on some VNs or something.
I'll leave you with some Maki, the best ED idol.
>>39124Do what you will. My days of internet battles over this stuff should be over and I never should have said anything. Whatever direction the happenings thread takes is something I'll no longer interfere with.
No.39143
>>39119>DS4246As soon as you put that in you have nothing else to do wit the remaining rack space..and I don't even think he needs stuff like a network switch when the home router is already there
No.39152
>>39143>I don't even think he needs stuff like a network switchI mean... Sure, but it's nice to not be bottle-necked by 1Gb/s speeds for accessing the NAS. With 24 disks, it should be able to hit 2GB/s for sequential reads (16x 125MB/s) easy, and with L1 ARC RAM caching, it should saturate line speed for writes (until the RAM cache is exhausted, then it would drop down to single disk write speeds). Unless the router has 10Gb, getting a dedicated switch is a worthy expense. There are plenty that only have a few 10Gb ports and have simplified Web UI management instead of going for a rackmount switch with Cisco-style CLI.
No.39153
>>39152bold assumption that he doesn't have the most overpriced router available
No.39156
>>39153Overpriced in what way... Is it one of those scary Asus gamer routers that have like 10 antennas and look like a spider... Or overpriced like a Ubiquiti switch with 25Gb SFP28 that remains under-utilized...
>>39155DS4246's are actually fairly quiet compared to other rackmount gear. It's probably the other stuff in the rack making all of the noise. I watch that guy's videos every now and then. If I had to wager a guess, all of the other stuff in his rack at that time was for mining Chia (bleh. crypto). He had a 3 rack setup almost entirely of storage at one point for Chia. Nowadays he makes videos reviewing LLM models using a quad 3090 setup and is one of the few people who critically analyses their capabilities instead of going "wow AI so cool future technology look at my stack of mac minis getting 100tk/s ai nvidia factory"
No.39157
I don't know what Verm's assuming, I just have a normal Fios router that nets me a cool 2Gb/s but it's not that amazing. If I had a way to get faster internet I would, probably will look into all avenues for that come the next house.
>>39119>DS4246Is there any reason to ever go any more than this in terms of storage safety/lifespan or is this about the best I can buy for my buck.
No.39158
Apparently verm has a server that was supposedly $20k-30k 3 years ago….. Gonna find out if it’s at all good when he either posts or sends me the specs….
No.39159
I think where he got that information is this server that I ordered for them, roughly when I started working at the company he works at.
On black friday it was heavily discounted
https://www.dell.com/en-ca/shop/dell-poweredge-servers/poweredge-r760-rack-server/spd/poweredge-r760/pe_r760_15724_vi_vp No.39160
the server he's talking about that I have stored under a bed...
Dell PowerEdge R740XD
Dual Intel Xeon Silver 4110 2.2GHz, 8 Core/16 Thread, 9.6GT/s,11M Cache CPU’s
160GB RAM (2666MT/s, Dual Rank) (16GB x 10)
PERC H740P 8GB RAID Controller
12.6 TB RAW (7 * 1.8TB) 10k RPM SAS 12Gbps 2.5” SAS HDD
iDRAC 9 Enterprise
Dual 16GB microSDHC/SDXC Card
Dual 750W Power Supply
Ready Rails
VMWare ESXi 6.7 U3 Embedded on flash media
No.39161
>>39160So… it’s only 7 bays?
No.39162
>>39160don't forget all the cat fur clogging those parts up everywhere
No.39163
>>39162parents house, not the one with the cat
No.39165
>>39163awesome, clean server then
No.39166
I mean it should, assuming it’s got 24 bays, be equal to or better than
>>39155, right? Although no RAID support so I dunno what the other ones are.
No.39167
>>39166>PERC H730P, H740P, HBA330Or wait is non RAID only applicable to the HBA330 one?
No.39168
>>39157>Is there any reason to ever go any more than thisWell... There's the NetApp DS4486, which is the exact same form factor, but double the amount of drives (each drive sled holds two drives at once), but you lose multipath redundancy. Ordinarily, like in the DS4246 or DS2246, each SAS drive has two access paths so that if one of the drive controllers dies, you don't lose any uptime, but with the DS4486, each drive gets only one access path.
If you still want more drives than that... There's the NetApp DE6600, which can hold 60 drives. Unlike the DS4246 or DS4486, it does not use drive caddies (which you need to screw each drive into), instead it uses integrated slide-out trays that you put the drives into and then back them onto the connector.
All of them support both SAS and SATA drives. Both the DS4246 and DS4486 are dual voltage 120~240V, but the DE6600 is 240V only. With the DE6600, you would also likely need to replace the controller cards with "NetApp 100120-113" cards. Another quirk of them is that you need a minimum of 20 drives, whereas the DS4246 and DS4486 will accept any number of drives. The DE6600 are much louder than either. If you're curious about them, Digital Spaceport has a fairly in-depth video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ww6Nvn0aTUAlso, he has a newer, better video on the DS4246:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HkPNOb-arXc>in terms of storage safety/lifespanThe disk shelf will outlast your drives. Safety mainly comes down to how fault tolerant your RAID layout is, and making periodic backups (RAID is not a backup!). Having a UPS to protect your drives from blackouts is also important. There's two main types of UPS depending on how "clean" the AC waveform is coming into your house: line-interactive, and online double-conversion. line-interactive UPS's modulate the AC waveform to deal with voltage fluctuations, but they cannot fix voltage ripple, so any bad AC is going to pass through to your load, assuming you're not running on battery. Online double-conversion UPS's can deal with voltage ripple, but they do so at the expense of efficiency because all incoming electricity is rectified to DC, filtered, and then converted back to a clean pure sine AC waveform. Line-interactive UPS's also tend to be a little bit slower to switchover to battery (but not in any meaningful sense.), whereas online double-conversion UPS's switchover instantly.
Oh, and in terms of backups... If you have the space... I've been oggling a
Quantum Scalar i500 that's fully populated with LTO5 FC tape drives. It should have a total capacity of around 225 tapes, for a total capacity somewhere in the range of 337TB to 675TB. The low end number is for uncompressed media, like video, whereas the high end is for compressible media like text (think OS backups and the like). You would need a fibre channel switch to use it, though, and a fibre channel card, ideally in the same server as the HBA for the disk shelf, so you can directly access the storage and write to tape as fast as possible to prevent wear (tape runs at a single, constant speed, so slow-downs mean the tape has to rewind, which slightly stretches it over time, which isn't good for the tape. In a worst-case scenario the tape can snap and get tangled in the tape drive).
>is this about the best I can buy for my buckYeah, pretty much. The DS4243/DS4246 tends to run around $300 plus shipping. DS4486 tends to run around double that at around $600. The DE6600 is typically found in the $600-$1000 range.
The DS4246 is pretty much plug and play, as is the DS4486. Either are generally going to be the best you can buy for the price, in terms of expansion storage. The DE6600 is a lot more finicky.
As far as pairing a server with it goes, I would probably recommend something like a Dell R740 if you want to put a dual slot GPU inside (Note: you're definitely not putting a 4090 or anything like that inside.). Or, you could go with an R740XD if you want to start out with 12x to 18x drives and then see if you need a disk shelf like mentioned above. If you more or less just want something to connect up to the disk shelf, you could get an R640, which is 1U instead of 2U like the R740's. Those can fit a few single slot PCIe cards you want to add networking cards, an HBA, or a single slot GPU for things like video transcoding for Jellyfin or Plex.
If you want, you could go a generation older with an R730 or even R720 (or R630 or R620). Parts are plentiful and cheap. I personally would just recommend an Rx40 server because they support Xeon Scalable gen 1 and 2, which supports PCIe 4.0, NVMe, and Intel Optane Persistent Memory which allows cheap, high capacity RAM expansion; e.g. single stick 512GB Optane Pmem100 is ~$200. single stick 256GB DDR4 is ~$750. Pmem needs to be paired with at least one DRAM stick per channel, though, so you can't just use all Pmem. Most Intel Xeon CPUs top out around 1TB of RAM, so if you want to go beyond that, you would need to look at the -M (2TB per CPU) or -L (4.5TB per CPU) SKU Xeon CPUs.
No.39169
>>39166Not, really, no.
>>39160 uses 2.5" drives, not 3.5" drives. 2.5" drives really only come in SSDs nowadays, and unless you want to pay out the nose for storage, I wouldn't recommend it... On the other hand, if you win the lottery, Samsung makes 32TB SAS drives, so 24x 2.5" drive servers technically can hold the most amount of storage possible per rack-unit of space. But those cost like $3000 per drive. Look up "Samsung PM1643a 30.72TB" if you're curious.
>>39167Yesn't. Those RAID cards do hardware RAID. You can
technically make RAID0 groups that contain a single disk and pass those through to the host, but it's generally not recommended to do so because RAID controllers mask the SMART info because you're not really meant to have single disk RAID groups... You're meant to have actual RAID groups of a few disks, so having any SMART info visible doesn't really make sense.
Whether you plan on using TrueNAS (my preference) or unRAID, those both use software RAID, and expect to see actual disks rather than virtual disks. Part of how they check drive health is by monitoring SMART info, and checking drive temperature and so on, which isn't possible with a RAID controller. Again, it's technically possible, but not recommended.
No.39170
But, anyways, used Dell servers and components are very affordable. If you want to use an HBA330 instead of a PERC card, you can easily swap them out. You can get the cards for like $20 on ebay (Note: you do NOT want the PCIe card, you would want the little mini mono card). I'm not sure if it's possible with the newer PERC cards, but I know on the older ones people would flash them with "IT mode" firmware, which basically just turns them into an HBA and disables the RAID functionality.
If you do go with a Dell server, I would recommend asking the seller if the server has "iDRAC Enterprise". This is the out-of-band management Web UI, which allows you to access the integrated KVM so you can do things like access the BIOS during startup from the comfort of your browser, turn it off or on, check server temperatures, check fan speeds, check warnings, etc. Even if the server is off, so long as the iDRAC ethernet port is plugged in, you can access the web UI.
If they don't know whether it has iDRAC Enterprise, ask them for the Dell service tag (pic related).
Dell's support page lets you input the service tag for any device, including their servers, and you can check what the device was originally configured for. Pic related's service tag shows: 1NQ0TS1. If you plug that into the Dell support page, it pulls up that it's a Dell R820. If you click "Product Specifications", you should see that it came with "iDRAC7 Enterprise". You can do this for any of their servers.
No.39171
Oh yeah, I forgot to mention, not that you should be installing OS's very often, but the web UI's KVM even lets you upload ISOs to expose to the machine as a virtual DVD drive for installing an operating system so you don't need to burn an ISO to a flash drive. Very handy.
No.39180
>>39174Interesting... Those are definitely 3.5" bays.
>>39175It's missing the midplane for the additional 4 drives, but those aren't too hard to find. As is, that should be able to hold 14 3.5" drives. There should be an additional 2 drive bays on the rear.
No.39181
>>39175>>39179Oh. I guess there's no rear drive expansion. That's also pretty easy to find.
Also, it appears to be missing the PERC or HBA330 card. It would be located on the right in the slot beneath the blue tab that says "RISER".
>>39179Nice that it has 10Gb ports.
No.39182
Shipping it to him would cost under 1000$... And it has company data on it. Maybe i could work something out but it's a lot of effort on me
No.39183
>>39180>be able to hold 14 3.5" drivesEhhh, would really gimp me on storage vs the extra 10 bays, unless there’s a really good reason to use that server over the 24 bays one I may refrain from using it as so to futureproof the server. Though if you can think of any use for it, I’ll set it up alongside the 24 bays one and maybe make it a free access server under a DMZ for all the cool kissu people to utilize.
No.39184
Actually just bring it back with you now and I’ll pay the shipping cost. Would probably make for a nice thread and thing for kissu to have. Just need to figure out how to put it on a separate IP or maybe proxy traffic on it publicly through a separate IP.
No.39185
Not like the 24 bay one is going to cost me much of anything compared to the HDDs I’ll be putting in it.
No.39187
>>39183>unless there’s a really good reason to use that server over the 24 bays oneA DS4246 is not a server. You need something to interact with the DS4246. A DS4246 is not much different from a glorified USB hard drive enclosure. It just happens to use SAS, holds a lot more drives, and is conveniently rackable.
To use a DS4246, you need an HBA that has external SAS ports (doesn't matter what kind), and you need at least one (two is better) external SAS to QSFP cables to connect the HBA to the DS4246. Server PCIe cards, HBAs included, are designed to be put in server chassis with high airflow, so don't stick one in a PC with typical 120mm fans and expect it to last forever like most components. For testing it's fine, but long-term use is frowned upon.
No.39238
Haven't had much to do with updating everyone on this thread because I can't FUCKING buy the hard drives for some godforsaken reason.
Got 5 of the 24tb golds off Amazon today and those will make up ~1/5th of what I need for the full 24 bay server.
It's so annoying how much this all will probably cost me at the end of the day but at least once I have it all it shouldn't need to ever require a size increase since anime won't go up in storage space cost and even assuming I put 1/3rd of the drives to RAID it's still 384tb of space.
Although before I buy any of these, what's the difference between WD241KRYZ and WD242KRYZ....
No.39255
>>39238>what's the difference between WD241KRYZ and WD242KRYZ....Nothing anyone has commented about online. Just different SKUs for the same product, with 241 being an older out of production SKU. Could be anything. Minor hardware or firmware change.
No.39287
>>39187Oh, forgot to ask, does this mean I should still get that server verm has or no?
No.39309
>Yes, you can have a home server and use a domain name to mask its IP address by using a service like>Cloudflare or a proxy, but it requires technical setup and may be less reliable than a dedicated hosting service. The domain name itself won't obscure your IP; rather, a third-party service will act as an intermediary, with the domain name pointing to the service's IP address, and the service then forwarding the traffic to your home server. well that gives me more options
someone come up with a reason for me to waste more money to buy this for
>>39175https://www.newegg.com/p/N82E16888892012i'm not willing to waste money like a retard if i'm not inspired
No.39314
>>39311that's why i need an actual reason to spend on it, I can't justify dropping 8k for no reason (I could put it in stocks but lmao the stock market may as well just buy the gpu)
No.39315
>>3930996GB is a werid spot. It's enough to run some of the big LLMs, like Deepseek R1 671B, GLM-4.5-Air or GLM-4.6, but only if you quantize them down to like Q2 (which neuters them a lot; Q2 means the model size is 2/16 the original full model size from FP16). The best LLM (without quantization) you can run in 96GB is probably Qwen 3 Omni, which is a multimodal LLM that supports text, audio, image, and video input and text, audio and image output. Very cool model. It's not to the level of ChatGPT or GLM though.
For any of the big LLMs, you really want at least 256GB for a modest, non-neutering quantization like Q8 or Q6, and 512GB or more to run without quantization.
Personally, I've been eyeing one of these:
https://ebay.us/m/WfSGJvIt has 8x V100 SXM2 GPUs connected by NVlink so each GPU has a direct memory connection to the others, which means the memory bandwidth is effectively 8x that of a single GPU (~7TB/s total) for parallelizable tasks like running LLMs. LLMs run faster the memory bandwidth in a pretty linear fashion; tk/s = (model size in GB) / (memory bandwidth in GB/s). So, it would be a great platform for running LLMs, but well ... It draws like 2.5kW under load, and Volta doesnt support INT8. I've heard that this means INT8 quantized models get expanded back to FP16, doubling their size, and because it's rather old it doesn't have newer CUDA drivers. I'm not really sure whether that stuff is true though because my Pascal P5000 and P4000 run INT8 quantized stuff just fine even though they don't support INT8 natively either, but maybe professional GPU support is different from enterprise GPU support?? No idea.
No.39316
In other words: I wouldn't buy it.
No.39331
https://a.co/d/cEh25ch 320 tb vs 384 tb is not significant, still more than I’ll ever need probably
Do I buy now or do I wait for a better deal? 20% on drives that normally sell like hotcakes seems the best deal I’ll get.
No.39349
Can you start a mail service with cool Kissu handles like @boson so I can have a cool mail address